Hello Shanna. Like you, I don;t condone any of the nasty groups that you list. So...here's an analogy: If you live, for example, in Chicago and some white supremacists also live in Chicago (and the city therefore makes money from them...in taxes, etc), would you move out of that city? Would you expect the Mayor of Chicago to censor them or force them to move out? Using the Substack platform (which is determinedly neutral/agnostic) doesn't mean that you condone everyone else who uses it.
Hate speech is illegal (in many countries, anyway) so might it not be more constructive for those who are (justifiably) angry about these hateful people to report their illegal activity to the appropriate authorities, rather than expecting a neutral platform to shut them down? Or feeling that you have to leave their "city"? (Censorship never did any society any good....ever in the history of the world.)
Here's Medium's more aligned-with-my-values policy page on hateful content in case you haven't seen it. If you like Substack enough to overlook their deficiencies in this area, I respect your choice: https://policy.medium.com/medium-rules-30e5502c4eb4
But I actually pay the Medium $5/month subscription fee, whereas I would never, ever consider it for Substack based on these differences. Just my two cents!
i 'liked' your post above...but i don't like the situation. yes, there are other platforms, but why does that despicable group put you in a position to have to consider a move. constitutional free speech should not ever condone/allow hate speech. they are not in the same catagory. too many on line platforms are allowing mis/disinformation out to the uninformed masses. i'm so sick of it. it might just take a mass exodus from social media...
Oh dear, I guess I’ve been drinking the Kool-Aid of the Substack editors, who go on about democratizing access to information through their platform whilst tolerating hate speech as your point out. So maybe it’s back to medium? I don’t know… will have to do some pondering. but thank you for raising the red flag.
I'm with you all the way Shanna! Your beliefs & morals are also mine! No-one it seems has learned from the past, particularly the 20th century. I despair, I know I can't change people's views and I accept that, everyone is entitled to their own opinions etc. I just don't want to have to listen to it or read it, I am totally offended when others spew their bile and ranting away a load of BS! Because really it's not about the people they attack, it's about them! They spend all their time putting labels on everyone else but if you label them, oh no, they say I'm not racist but.... I'm not homophobic but....... These people will never just admit to what they are. It's quite obvious what they are but try and get them to admit it!! Knowing you, you will make the right decision for you and stick to it. I'm grieving at the moment so other problems around the world are not relevant to me! I lost my beloved brother at the weekend suddenly and the world's problems don't take precedent as I'm sure you'll understand. MY mom is still in the grips of life and death at the moment and the hardest things for my sister and myself to do was break the news to her in that delicate state that is her life from now until..... Very worried about her and hoping that she won't just give up! Dave was only 63, he used to be a fireman and the station he worked at had a minute's silence and a roll of honour at 6pm last night, he was so well liked and loved and we will miss him dearly, sorry for being a bringer of bad news, I know you would just listen which is what I need at the moment, take care Shanna & Catherine (have I got the name right?) apologies if not, hugs xxx
Free platforms are part of the problem. If all users had to pay a subscription fee - as Catherine G. mentions below - it would be enough to dissuade many extremists and trolls from participating.
Hoping founders of Substack will do the right thing - like waiting for the founders/owners of Meta, X and the myriad of other social media platforms to finally be responsible seems naive at this point in time.
Everyone should be demanding more regulation of these spaces from their legislators.
Thank you for your thoughtfulness and having a moral compass. I also condemn Nazis and hate and misinformation.
It’s a moral dilemma.
At some point you’re faced with what doing nothing means.
“Those who stand for nothing fall for anything”, Alexander Hamilton.
Doing nothing means standing for something that is out of alignment with your values and what that message sends.
We have terrible internet for example at our property in Portugal but we refuse to subscribe to Starlink because of what Elon Musk represents and so we can’t stand for him or contribute to his profit.
So we put up with very slow non fiber download speeds until our neighborhood improves but we’re not impacting an audience, readers, etc.
Just ourselves.
When the time comes the answer will present itself and an alternate platform.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us and being an intelligent, compassionate human with empathy and vulnerability.
Hello Shanna. Like you, I don;t condone any of the nasty groups that you list. So...here's an analogy: If you live, for example, in Chicago and some white supremacists also live in Chicago (and the city therefore makes money from them...in taxes, etc), would you move out of that city? Would you expect the Mayor of Chicago to censor them or force them to move out? Using the Substack platform (which is determinedly neutral/agnostic) doesn't mean that you condone everyone else who uses it.
Hate speech is illegal (in many countries, anyway) so might it not be more constructive for those who are (justifiably) angry about these hateful people to report their illegal activity to the appropriate authorities, rather than expecting a neutral platform to shut them down? Or feeling that you have to leave their "city"? (Censorship never did any society any good....ever in the history of the world.)
Here's Medium's more aligned-with-my-values policy page on hateful content in case you haven't seen it. If you like Substack enough to overlook their deficiencies in this area, I respect your choice: https://policy.medium.com/medium-rules-30e5502c4eb4
But I actually pay the Medium $5/month subscription fee, whereas I would never, ever consider it for Substack based on these differences. Just my two cents!
One of your best and most important posts. First I was blind, but now I can see
i 'liked' your post above...but i don't like the situation. yes, there are other platforms, but why does that despicable group put you in a position to have to consider a move. constitutional free speech should not ever condone/allow hate speech. they are not in the same catagory. too many on line platforms are allowing mis/disinformation out to the uninformed masses. i'm so sick of it. it might just take a mass exodus from social media...
Might be intriguing to see where the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) comes down on this.
Oh dear, I guess I’ve been drinking the Kool-Aid of the Substack editors, who go on about democratizing access to information through their platform whilst tolerating hate speech as your point out. So maybe it’s back to medium? I don’t know… will have to do some pondering. but thank you for raising the red flag.
I've been following Casey Newton of Platformer on this. He left Substack because of it. I would like to see all the people who aren't Nazis leave.
And you've given me a good reason to avoid the lingerie department at Macy's.
I'm with you all the way Shanna! Your beliefs & morals are also mine! No-one it seems has learned from the past, particularly the 20th century. I despair, I know I can't change people's views and I accept that, everyone is entitled to their own opinions etc. I just don't want to have to listen to it or read it, I am totally offended when others spew their bile and ranting away a load of BS! Because really it's not about the people they attack, it's about them! They spend all their time putting labels on everyone else but if you label them, oh no, they say I'm not racist but.... I'm not homophobic but....... These people will never just admit to what they are. It's quite obvious what they are but try and get them to admit it!! Knowing you, you will make the right decision for you and stick to it. I'm grieving at the moment so other problems around the world are not relevant to me! I lost my beloved brother at the weekend suddenly and the world's problems don't take precedent as I'm sure you'll understand. MY mom is still in the grips of life and death at the moment and the hardest things for my sister and myself to do was break the news to her in that delicate state that is her life from now until..... Very worried about her and hoping that she won't just give up! Dave was only 63, he used to be a fireman and the station he worked at had a minute's silence and a roll of honour at 6pm last night, he was so well liked and loved and we will miss him dearly, sorry for being a bringer of bad news, I know you would just listen which is what I need at the moment, take care Shanna & Catherine (have I got the name right?) apologies if not, hugs xxx
I have a blog on medium.com and like their site a lot.
Free platforms are part of the problem. If all users had to pay a subscription fee - as Catherine G. mentions below - it would be enough to dissuade many extremists and trolls from participating.
Hoping founders of Substack will do the right thing - like waiting for the founders/owners of Meta, X and the myriad of other social media platforms to finally be responsible seems naive at this point in time.
Everyone should be demanding more regulation of these spaces from their legislators.
Thank you for your thoughtfulness and having a moral compass. I also condemn Nazis and hate and misinformation.
It’s a moral dilemma.
At some point you’re faced with what doing nothing means.
“Those who stand for nothing fall for anything”, Alexander Hamilton.
Doing nothing means standing for something that is out of alignment with your values and what that message sends.
We have terrible internet for example at our property in Portugal but we refuse to subscribe to Starlink because of what Elon Musk represents and so we can’t stand for him or contribute to his profit.
So we put up with very slow non fiber download speeds until our neighborhood improves but we’re not impacting an audience, readers, etc.
Just ourselves.
When the time comes the answer will present itself and an alternate platform.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us and being an intelligent, compassionate human with empathy and vulnerability.
You rock,
Love,
Ludmila ~Your neighbor in the Algarve
Do the hard thing.